Sep 26, 2022 11:48
1 yr ago
33 viewers *
French term
situation projetée
French to English
Law/Patents
Law (general)
Court case relating to arguments about liability of a lender on a house building project when things went horribly wrong. Monsieur AAA was the original architect. His plans were adopted à l'identique by a builder.
"Par la suite, les plans établis par l’architecte indépendant ont été annexés tels quels au contrat de construction conclu le 21 juin 2015.
De fait, la Cour constatera qu’ils ont été repris sans aucune modification du Constructeur.
Ils sont strictement identiques à ceux établis par Monsieur AAA :
Perspective situation projetée PCMI6
Plan en coupe sur le terrain situation projetée PCMI3
Pignon Nord-Est situation projetée PCMI5
Pignon Sud-Ouest situation projetée PCMI5
Plan de toiture situation projetée PCMI5 (Pièces n° 4 à 6).
Le cachet du Constructeur ne figure même pas sur ces plans…
Et pour cause, la paternité de ces plans est sans lien avec le Constructeur, et revient intégralement à Monsieur AAA."
This looks something simple like "situation as planned", but it's funny how it can apply to such a variety of different expressions (with no commas involved). Maybe strikes a bell with someone?
"Par la suite, les plans établis par l’architecte indépendant ont été annexés tels quels au contrat de construction conclu le 21 juin 2015.
De fait, la Cour constatera qu’ils ont été repris sans aucune modification du Constructeur.
Ils sont strictement identiques à ceux établis par Monsieur AAA :
Perspective situation projetée PCMI6
Plan en coupe sur le terrain situation projetée PCMI3
Pignon Nord-Est situation projetée PCMI5
Pignon Sud-Ouest situation projetée PCMI5
Plan de toiture situation projetée PCMI5 (Pièces n° 4 à 6).
Le cachet du Constructeur ne figure même pas sur ces plans…
Et pour cause, la paternité de ces plans est sans lien avec le Constructeur, et revient intégralement à Monsieur AAA."
This looks something simple like "situation as planned", but it's funny how it can apply to such a variety of different expressions (with no commas involved). Maybe strikes a bell with someone?
Proposed translations
(English)
References
| situation existante / situation projetée |
Daryo
|
Proposed translations
+2
13 hrs
Conor McAuley
France
France
Native in English
Specializes in field
France
Excellence, Expertise & Experience
Native in: English (Variants: Irish, British, Wales / Welsh, UK, Scottish)
Works in: French to English, English
Related KudoZ points
:
210
Selected
as planned as per PCMXX
From Sévérine's Discussion entry: "PCMI1, 2, 3 etc. are all the plans that need to be provided for building permits."
My line of argument is more stylistic than anything else, but I'm sure Mr/Mrs/Miss Lawyer who drew up his argument arguing hisher side of the story would prefer "planned", it's just more natural, idomatic.
Everything when to plan.
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Note added at 13 hrs (2022-09-27 01:19:26 GMT)
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Obviously you can choose your own words for "as per": "in conformance with', "according to", "in accordance with" (my preference maybe), "in compliance with" (more legal), etc.
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Note added at 13 hrs (2022-09-27 01:21:04 GMT)
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It is probably preferable not to repeat "as", it's a bit clunky to do so.
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Note added at 2 days 15 hrs (2022-09-29 03:27:05 GMT)
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Typo in my first post: idiomatic, obviously
My line of argument is more stylistic than anything else, but I'm sure Mr/Mrs/Miss Lawyer who drew up his argument arguing hisher side of the story would prefer "planned", it's just more natural, idomatic.
Everything when to plan.
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Note added at 13 hrs (2022-09-27 01:19:26 GMT)
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Obviously you can choose your own words for "as per": "in conformance with', "according to", "in accordance with" (my preference maybe), "in compliance with" (more legal), etc.
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Note added at 13 hrs (2022-09-27 01:21:04 GMT)
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It is probably preferable not to repeat "as", it's a bit clunky to do so.
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Note added at 2 days 15 hrs (2022-09-29 03:27:05 GMT)
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Typo in my first post: idiomatic, obviously
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Selected automatically based on peer agreement."
+1
10 hrs
AllegroTrans
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
Native in English
Specializes in field
United Kingdom
Sensible solutions
Native in: English (Variant: Wessexois) 
Works in: French to English, English, English to French
Related KudoZ points
:
1362
intended
Maybe avoids the possible anbiguity of "projected"
Obviously need to adjust the positiion of this adjective on a line by line basis
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Note added at 10 hrs (2022-09-26 22:33:12 GMT)
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You could also infer "planned"
Obviously need to adjust the positiion of this adjective on a line by line basis
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Note added at 10 hrs (2022-09-26 22:33:12 GMT)
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You could also infer "planned"
11 hrs
Adrian MM.
Austria
Austria
Native in English
Specializes in field
Austria
Retd.T&I, Barrister & Austro-Advokat
Native in: English (Variants: British, Scottish) 
Works in: Spanish to English, English to Spanish, French to English, and 5 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
359
project ('gone-to-plan') scenario
No need to toss up between the architectural projection and planning meanings, as highlighted by Daryo. Project scenario covers both permutations, possibly in every instance and on every line.
Anyhow or howbeit, it's neither at the drawing board stage nor nor off-plan, but as-completed.
Note the non-literary, but still literate 'gone-to-plan' telegrammatic style, as used in UK construction contracts (and in Souf' London, mate).
Anyhow or howbeit, it's neither at the drawing board stage nor nor off-plan, but as-completed.
Note the non-literary, but still literate 'gone-to-plan' telegrammatic style, as used in UK construction contracts (and in Souf' London, mate).
Example sentence:
A project scenario is a description of what proposal will look like when it is *completed*
Reference:
http://www.linguee.fr/anglais-francais/traduction/if+all+goes+to+plan.html
http://www.smartcapitalmind.com/what-is-a-project-scenario.htm
+2
1 hr
Séverine Watson
France
France
Native in English
France
Technical Translator FR/ES --> EN
Native in: English (Variants: British, UK)
Works in: French to English, Spanish to English
Related KudoZ points
:
4
projected xxx (no need to translate situation)
I think that "situation" is redundant in English.
Projections are used a lot in architecture for 2D or 3D drawings.
https://www.designingbuildings.co.uk/wiki/Projections
As such, you could put:
Projected perspective, PCMI6
Projected cross-sectional drawing on the site, PCMI3
Projected gable to north-east, PCMI5
Projected gable to south-west, PCMI5
Projected roof plan, PCMI5.
Hope that helps put you on the right track!
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Note added at 19 hrs (2022-09-27 07:39:02 GMT)
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@Mpoma, I still think that there is no need to translate "situation" here.
However, I take your point about my suggestion not being the most suitable for all the document titles.
Using "planned" as suggested by the others would be a good fit in my mind.
Projections are used a lot in architecture for 2D or 3D drawings.
https://www.designingbuildings.co.uk/wiki/Projections
As such, you could put:
Projected perspective, PCMI6
Projected cross-sectional drawing on the site, PCMI3
Projected gable to north-east, PCMI5
Projected gable to south-west, PCMI5
Projected roof plan, PCMI5.
Hope that helps put you on the right track!
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Note added at 19 hrs (2022-09-27 07:39:02 GMT)
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@Mpoma, I still think that there is no need to translate "situation" here.
However, I take your point about my suggestion not being the most suitable for all the document titles.
Using "planned" as suggested by the others would be a good fit in my mind.
Example sentence:
Projected roof plan showing all penetrations, pitch, and direction of slope
Note from asker:
| This interpretation is tempting, but on the balance of probabilities I don't think it works, because although "projected" goes fine with a perspective view (1st line), it doesn't really make any sense with a "plan en coupe" or design of a gable (not specified as being "perspective") |
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Patricia Fierro, M. Sc.
2 hrs
|
| agree |
Anastasia Kalantzi
3 hrs
|
| neutral |
Daryo
: "projections" as used in drawings (type of graphical representation of various objects) is s.t. entirely else than "projections" as in "what is planed" - not much clear which one of these two exactly is the intended meaning of "projetée" in this ST.
7 hrs
|
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The irony is I did hesitate about the dual meaning of "projected", and toyed with suggesting "planned" but I couldn't find any suitable examples online to back up my hunch.
|
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| neutral |
FPC
: I agree with Daryo
8 hrs
|
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Fair enough. :)
|
9 hrs
at project completion
See my comment in the section below
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Note added at 20 hrs (2022-09-27 08:25:16 GMT)
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It's implied but you may add 'planned', i.e. "at planned project completion'.
As I said this is kind of as-to-be-built (standard locution in engineering) blueprint. As-bult then would be how it was actually implemented (normally documented by further drawings).
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Note added at 20 hrs (2022-09-27 08:25:16 GMT)
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It's implied but you may add 'planned', i.e. "at planned project completion'.
As I said this is kind of as-to-be-built (standard locution in engineering) blueprint. As-bult then would be how it was actually implemented (normally documented by further drawings).
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Daryo
: or any other unambiguous variant to the same effect
14 hrs
|
| disagree |
Conor McAuley
: Nothing absolutely wrong with it, but a gross over-interpretation in my opinion. OK, sorry, I've just convinced myself into a "Disagree", and I don't generally disagree on questions where I'm "competing".
2 days 6 hrs
|
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It's not if you consider it's a document understood to be drafted before work is done. "At completion" here means actually "as planned to be once completed". If it's on a planning blueprint there's no confusion, but I get what you mean. .
|
2 days 20 hrs
Planned location and orientation
ATT: MPOMA (polite heads-up)
I'm sure that I'm right here. My reference is good and explains what PCM actually means
The only doubt I have is to how this might be translated in English, but I'm gong to say that the other answers are all wrong if they interpret planning as some sort of scheduling or scenario.
I'm sure that I'm right here. My reference is good and explains what PCM actually means
The only doubt I have is to how this might be translated in English, but I'm gong to say that the other answers are all wrong if they interpret planning as some sort of scheduling or scenario.
Reference comments
1 day 8 mins
Reference:
situation existante / situation projetée
Defining a term by its opposite is usually very reliable:
Esquisse pour la rénovation & extension d’une maison mitoyenne / Villard d’Heria / Jura / FR / 2016
...
situation existante / situation projetée (present vs. future/planed)
...
throughout the document
http://antoinedevaux.info/assets/2016-03-f-.pdf
Construction projetée (état futur)
(couldn't be more explicit!)
https://www.urbinfos.fr/plans-et-formulaires/plan-de-masse-e...
PU - Planche 2 - situation projetée - PLANS_2
(all maps of the intended final result, so "Situation projetée:" = as planed / intended end result)
https://www.dentcreuse.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/plan-d...
Esquisse pour la rénovation & extension d’une maison mitoyenne / Villard d’Heria / Jura / FR / 2016
...
situation existante / situation projetée (present vs. future/planed)
...
throughout the document
http://antoinedevaux.info/assets/2016-03-f-.pdf
Construction projetée (état futur)
(couldn't be more explicit!)
https://www.urbinfos.fr/plans-et-formulaires/plan-de-masse-e...
PU - Planche 2 - situation projetée - PLANS_2
(all maps of the intended final result, so "Situation projetée:" = as planed / intended end result)
https://www.dentcreuse.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/plan-d...
Discussion
I agree that situation projetée here most likely means something along the lines of "planned" or "as to be built". This is because most of these plans / drawings / blueprints needed to apply for a building permit normally must come in two copies: one showing the present situation and one showing the situation once the project is completed
PS: situation here is meant as a general term, whereas it has a specific meaning in PCMI1 plan de *situation* which the plan/ drawing showing the location and relative position of the plot where the project will be built
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/french-to-english/construction-civ...
is about s.t. entirely else - it's got to do with staged payments to the building contractors for a project already approved and being executed.
This ST is about applying for planning permission - few steps in the lifecycle of a construction project BEFORE this kind of "situation" could become relevant.
What "situation projetée" could mean in the ST is either "the graphic representation of ..." or "as planned".
And PCMI1, 2, 3 etc. are all the plans that need to be provided for building permits.
Trust me, been there done that twice.
This gives you an idea of what PCMI1, 2 and 3 look like:
https://www.plans-permis-construire.fr/html/exemples
/pcmi123.php
And this is the Cerfa form for applying to build a home with all the PCMI documents listed:
https://www.formulaires.service-public.fr/gf/cerfa_13406.do
https://www.comme-un-pingouin-dans-le-desert.fr/pcmi-5-plan-...
And yes, it might be useful to know what PCMI stands for.